D.Hearne
New Member
Oh, and I went thru Autotrader.com's site today, there's a couple pages of nice used GT's for sale there, in just a 200 mile radius of here ( south Louisiana) The posted prices are above what new MSRP's are. Go figure.
they have to get that negative equity out of it somehow.....D.Hearne said:Oh, and I went thru Autotrader.com's site today, there's a couple pages of nice used GT's for sale there, in just a 200 mile radius of here ( south Louisiana) The posted prices are above what new MSRP's are. Go figure.
What negative equity? That part's born by the original buyer. The price they're asking for a used car is way out of proportion to new ones. That's greed, pure and simple.bigcat said:they have to get that negative equity out of it somehow.....
Shaggydog2000 said:I went along with my friend to help her look at cars. She would be driving a brand new v6 mustang right now if it had a better interior. Compared to the other cars we drove, she found it fun to drive, maybe a bit big for her, but the interior was way behind those of other cars we drove in it's price range (Mistubishi Eclipse, Acura RSX, Hyundai Tiburon)..........
you didnt say it was a dealer, i thought it was private parties......D.Hearne said:What negative equity? That part's born by the original buyer. The price they're asking for a used car is way out of proportion to new ones. That's greed, pure and simple.
4u2nv said:It's called "winter".
351CJ said:Since when did July, August, September & October become winter months?
351CJ said:Thanks for making some comments back on my original topic.
I did not start this topic to slam Mustangs. I'm a Mustang owner and a Mustang fan. Nor did I really want to go off topic responding to personal attacks on my credibility.
The reason for for starting this topic was that I've been tracking the S197 Mustang sales and after 3 months of spectacular sales (March, April & May), sales of the 05 ( & now 06) Mustangs have dropped significantly, to the level where for the last 4 consecutive months sales of the 05 & 06 are running below the old 99 - 04 Mustang.
My thought was "Lets kick around some ideas as to why this has happened." After all I'm sure there are Ford people who read this. I'm also sure they are closely watching the sales #s and are interested in our thoughts as to what is going on.
Several people responded with their thoughts as to why the sales are slowing. In my initial post I lambased greedy dealers who are adding dealer markups. After thinking about this some more, there rarely is a single simple answer. It's more likely to be a combination of several factors. Here is a core dump on my thoughts as to possible explanations for what is going on.
1. Ford screwed up the V6-V8 product mix. Although Ford used historic Mustang V6-V8 sales (68% V6, 32% V8) to plan the 05 build mix. But someone at Ford forgot that with the old Mustang a lot of those V6s were to rental and other fleet customers. With the 05 Stang, Ford intentionally reduced the rental & fleet sales but did not adjust the V6-V8 build mix to better match what retail sales actually are. Although in the spring of 05 the GT build % was upped to 38%, the damage had already been done, creating a lingering shortage of GTs that is holding down Mustang sales.
2. Dealer mark ups. Dealers are taking advantage of the situation with greedy markups. This has turned a lot of people off which has resulted in delayed purchases, if not permanently lost Mustang customers.
3. Ford has screwed up the Vert - Coupe build mix by building too many Verts. I live in the cold northeast which is not good Vert county. Like LasVegas the dealers have more verts than they can possibly sell. Was building too many verts just a Ford marketing blunder, or a more sinister plan to increase Mustang profits since the verts are more profitable?
4. Only the die hard Mustang crazies are going to order and wait months for a GT. Most customers end up buying on impulse. If the Mustang they want is not sitting on a dealer's lot, they won't buy. Result, permanently lost Mustang sales.
5. Dealers who are not accepting A-Z plan purchases, or even worse have told customers they will take a plan sale but then back out of it. Again, more lost sales.
6. No matter what they do, the US auto manufacturers are history. Many consumers may think a Mustang is cool, but they have permanently switched to buying imports (rightly or wrongly) and will never again buy a domestic brand (Ford, GM or Chrysler).
7. As cool as the 05/06 Mustang looks, the new Mustang is not in step with today's consumers. Sure there are Mustang crazies who will keep buying Mustangs as long as they are made, but the # of Mustang crazies is shrinking. The Mustang (as most Ford brand cars) is sorely lacking the comforts and amenities that consumers are demanding on cars today such as overall vehicle comfort and ride, heated seats, stability control, climate control, power passenger's seat, more adjustable power driver's seat, NAV system, HID headlamps, good quality leather, etc.
8. Ford blew it with the V6. I don't care how much torque the 4.0L has, most customers barely understand HP let alone torque. With most Asian manufactures selling 260 - 300 HP V6s, the 220 HP Mustang V6 seems like an under acheiver. In addition, with the reduction in fleet sales, the V6 needs more creature comforts (see item 7) to compete with its Asian and European competition.
9. The auto market has become so segmented and consumers want so badly to drive something "different" that no matter how great a Mustang Ford builds, it's sales #s will continue to shrink because today's staus symbol is to drive something different. Consumers just don't want to be seen in the same vehicle that their neighbors are driving. The days of being cool driving the same car as your friend drives have long passed.
10. The 2 door coupe & vert market is dead. While the Mustang dominates this market segment, the Mustang is an anomoly, a vestage of yesterday that will continue to decline in sales no matter how good a Mustang Ford makes. After all, look at all the other 2 door cars that have fallen by the wayside.
11. Sticker shock. The core customer base for the Mustang has always been the working stiff. But with real wages after inflation constant if not declining for the average worker, the price creep on the Mustang has priced out a significant portion of its customer base.
12. No rebates. The consumer has been trained to wait for a great deal if they are buying an American vehicle. Since there are no rebates on the Mustang and it is unlikely that there will be any incentives on Mustangs as long as dealers still demand MSRP or MSRP + dealer markup, customers are waiting for a "deal".
13. Retro is over. As cool as most of us Mustang people think the S197 Mustang is, we are an anmoly that is out of touch with mainstream taste in America. The market for Retro is small and is limiting Mustang sales.
14. I'll just wait for the next Special Edition. We all know that there are SEs in the works. Why get a Mustang just like everyone else's (see item 9). I don't need a new car right now, I'll just sit tight and wait to see what SEs come out over the next couple years.
15. Ford has really screwed up with its allocation method. Too many Mustangs are going to the big high pressure, high markup dealers. My local small Ford dealer can't even order me the Mustang I want.
So what do you guys think? I'm not saying any of those above items are true or correct. I'm just throwing them out as possible reasons why sales have slowed.
I suspect Ford's going to loose a LOT of Stang sales like this. I share your pain. Only reason I haven't bought anything else and waited for mine is, there is nothing else I'm remotely interested in. If there was , I'd have been long gone by now.amnit:Hadda70Mach1 said:I'm in the same boat as 1200Bruce: I visited my dealer in the spring, expressed my interest in a Mustang GT with manual transmission. They of course had NO GT's. I've been back a few times to speak to the same salesman. They have no GT's that aren't bought, so no car I can test drive. They have no idea when they might have an available GT to test drive, manual or even automatic. And it's been seven months now!
I stopped by a dealer in Columbus, Ohio over the summer that had several GT's. They wouldn't let me drive one unless I commited to a purchase price beforehand - and they wanted $4,000 over sticker. Gee, let me think....no thanks.
I haven't bought a different car yet, but my interest in a new Mustang is slowly but surely fading. It's a cool car, but not cool enough that Ford can screw around like this.
4u2nv said:Maybe I should have said "autumn".
People plan for winter before it gets here. End of summer is typically when more focus (sales-wise) shift towards vehicles that have off-road capabilities to cope with inclement weather and uncertain driving conditions.
Some climates get snow in the fall, so it might have some effect earlier than the winter months.
Rontyco said:My daughter in Montreal just bought an 06' V6 with pony pkg.I have an 04Mach 1.If all families would buy in multiples we wouldn't be in this jam.