Blown Head Gasket and Cylinder Head Problem

[inliner]

I took off my cylinder heads this morning to replace a suspected blown gasket on the passenger side. These are my finding after removal:

1. No issues on the driver's side, i.e. the head gasket is in good shape with no signs of leakages, the cylinders and the spark plugs look clean.

2. Passenger side: cylinder 3 (the one closest to the firewall) found with water inside with signs of early corrosion, the gasket had signs of deterioration, the coolant ways on cylinder head was found in the condition as shown in the pictures.

I know that 3.8's are notorious for this problem and I was ready to replace the gasket. However, looking at the head I may need to either take them to a machine shop or get a new one

Appreciate any suggestions.

 

[inliner]

One more picture

 

[wmburns]

IMO, you should take it to a machine shop and get their professional opinion. However, at the end of the day, something will have to be done. It makes no sense to use the head in it's current condition. It will just start leaking within a short period of time.

Wasted time, effort, and $$ along with a generous dose of hair pulling will be the result.

How long was this condition allowed to continue? Can't help but wondering if it was too long.

Hate to bring bad news, but I suspect that you already knew it anyways.

 

[inliner]

Thanks for replying, wmburns.
Well, to give a little of background,Ii bought the car 5 years ago. Three years later, it blew the gasket for the first time (at least when I had it). I took it to a garage and got it repaired without going into details what the guy was doing and how. Now I realize I should have been more involved in it cause I well remember the gasket set I bought then han no new bolts and aspparently the old ones where used...
I have hardly run the car for the last year. When it one of the cylinders started to misfire 3-4 months ago, I changed all spark plugs and hasd the wires checked. It did not improve the situation. On my way back from the garage on that day i heard a knocking sound and saw clouds of smoke from the tailpipe. Luckily I was about to park it next to my house. I had no time to look at it until last weekend when I started working on it. So I can't say I ran it in this condition but it was parked with a headgasket blown for about 3 months.
I knew I have to do something about it when I saw the head this morning. Looking at the condition of the coolant ports I really doubt machining can help. How much can you machine away from the surface anyway?

 

[wmburns]

Recommed using the experience of a professional machine shop. That is what professionals do for a living.

A machine shop will be able to tell you if the heads you have are worth saving and what it will take to save them.

Note, I have read that shaving heads is not always a good idea. Consider your options carefully. Be sure to price out replacements (new and used).

 

[Aeroman]

Thanks for replying, wmburns.
Well, to give a little of background,Ii bought the car 5 years ago. Three years later, it blew the gasket for the first time (at least when I had it). I took it to a garage and got it repaired without going into details what the guy was doing and how. Now I realize I should have been more involved in it cause I well remember the gasket set I bought then han no new bolts and aspparently the old ones where used...
I have hardly run the car for the last year. When it one of the cylinders started to misfire 3-4 months ago, I changed all spark plugs and hasd the wires checked. It did not improve the situation. On my way back from the garage on that day i heard a knocking sound and saw clouds of smoke from the tailpipe. Luckily I was about to park it next to my house. I had no time to look at it until last weekend when I started working on it. So I can't say I ran it in this condition but it was parked with a headgasket blown for about 3 months.
I knew I have to do something about it when I saw the head this morning. Looking at the condition of the coolant ports I really doubt machining can help. How much can you machine away from the surface anyway?

Hi,
That head has leaked for some time judging by the corrosion around the entire perimeter of the gasket surface. The coolant passage noted is a bit too close for comfort although likely it could be repaired with laser welding in the coolant channel to get the correct land width back , you could probably pick-up a better head for much less than the cost to weld & re-machine the surface. Head skimming on a 3.8L should be O.K. since valves & compression ratio are low anyway. If it were mine I'd look for a replacement head (or better still; pair of heads).

ATB Aeroman

 

[MustangLX-5.0]

Yeah, machine shops around here charge and average of $200 per head to machine them clean and flat. I learned this just recently. Both the passeneger side and drivers side front are leaking on the outside. I posted the pictures in another post somewhere around here. I suspect the heads are also leaking on the inside somewhere. Because if I shut it off after it's been running for awhile.. wait about 5-10 minutes then start it up, it'll be missing right away for about 10 seconds, then slowly clears. No smoke. I think it's dribbling out someplace inside only when it gets hot enough. If I wait too long to start it back up, it wont miss at all. I'm thinking it's leaking, then what little leaked, dried up from the heat. It's been getting worse. The outsides only leak when it's cold and been sitting for at least a day, then theres a small puddle on the right side water pump galley and its all wet going up to the cyl. head/lower intake/block merging point. It's also coming out the pass side and making the front side of the block all wet. Only reason I haven't started the work yet isbecause of the cost of machining and bolts. The work is cake, it's paying for the rest. Aftermarket heads would be nice, but those aren't cheap either.

 

[inliner]

Thank you guys all for your replies.

If anybody is interested, here is the latest:

It took me a while to find some time to continue the work. I took both heads to a machine shop. The passenger side could have been re-manufactured but I didn't like the price. They quoted something like $ 100 for welding, then it would take machining, cleaning the valves and changing the valve gaskets to get the head into a decent shape. So I scrapped it. I got a head from a '97 stang in the junk yard nearby. Got it checked in the machine shop, machined the mating surface and changed the valve gaskets. It cost me $ 60 for the head and another $ 40 for the work.

I had another look at the driver side head. It was not that good as I had thought initially. I got it welded in one or two places, machined and changed the valve gaskets.

Assembling all back was a bit more difficult that disassembling as I really forgot what bolts and nuts were supposed to go where

Anyway, I did it all by myself and finished it in 1.5 days. There was a slight issue with placing the lower intake manifold 'cause the passenger side head was a '97 and it uses smaller size bolts to fix the intake manifold, and 6 instead of 7 as it is on the '95 model. Otherwise the swap was straightforward.

I started the car last week-end. The issue I have with it now is coolant running out thru the weep hole in the water pump.

It may be an indication of the gasket failure on the pump or a complete failure of the water pump? What I noticed is that it leaks at lower RPMs and seems to be running OK with no leaks at higher RPMs.

I would appreciate any advice on this.

 

[wmburns]

Sounds like you took all of the advice given and put it to the best use for your situation. Congrats!

On the water pump, perhaps you are trying to make something out of what may be nothing. Water pumps fail all the time. The bearing seals wear out and leak. The results is coolant seepage through the weep hole.

From looking at the corrosion in the heads, is it all that hard to believe that poor coolant could have also played a role in the water pump failure?

Why not start off with an easy fix and replace the water pump?

 

[Aeroman]

Yes..... a replacement water pump is in order!

Considering the job you just completed this one will be a walk in the park
You will need a special puller for removal of the power steering pulley & some deep sockets to take off some of the water pump nuts. Use a torque wrench for installation (Get a diagram for the torque sequence, some of the bolts take different torque settings) & take your time. One of the studs needs sealant on the threads into the casing. Note where the studs go (they are different lengths) they may unwind when you remove the nuts.
I guess you would have already replaced the coolant with new..... if not now is the time.
While you are at it you should consider replacement of the thermostat & hoses if funds allow.
ATB Aeroman.

 

[inliner]

wmburns, Aeroman - thanks! Your advice really helped me with it.

Thermostat.
When changing the head gaskets, I thought it would be a good idea to have a look at the thermostat. I removed the bolts and detached the pipe and... found no thermostat inside The previous owner may have removed it for one reason or another. Anyway I bought a new one and put it there. From the test runs it looked it was working properly.

Water pump.
Well, the water pump is going to be out for certain now. It's a shame that I have not checked the pump before changing the gaskets - I could have done all in one go. Hey, where is my torque wrench?

Coolant.
Yep, the coolant may have added to the corrosion on the heads. I have not seen many mustang heads after 15 years of use though. The car used to lose coolant (thru water pump weep hole?) and one or two times I topped it up with tap water as an emergency.

Now I am pretty sure that the head gasket failure was triggered by overheating which in turn was caused by no thermostat and failing water pump.