lambse, kams... rich?

Discussion in '1994 - 1995 Specific Tech' started by Mustangless, Nov 6, 2007.

  1. Mustangless

    Mustangless New Member

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    Well, let me try to start over with my maf curve

    Can somebody convert it for me?

    kg/hr
    1280.35
    909.79
    529.91
    322.35
    185.49
    109.93
    65.43
    37.84
    20.69

    volts
    4.1122
    3.5810
    2.8571
    2.2799
    1.7776
    1.3719
    .9988
    .6460
    .3521

    I don't think caledit is giving me the right curve, and when I try to use EA the car hardly runs.
     
    #21
  2. Stanger007

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    Going to your email.

    Wes
     
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  3. Mustangless

    Mustangless New Member

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    sent you one back, but let me say this.

    When I do the maf curve with EA it looks like what I think it should be, except it goes from


    0.0271 volts to
    0.75 volts

    I think that is why it runs so bad.
     
    #23
  4. Stanger007

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    The PCM will interpolate the numbers and figure out what is between your two points.

    But if you want to be tricky, you can put in your own number pair from the flowsheet (That's what I did for an extra resolution point down low on your MAF).

    Your injector offset vs battery voltage is going to really affect your idle fuel and should be where you are tuning to get it right. Last time I saw your tune you had the Cobra offsets in which won't work well with the injector slopes you had.

    Reset your KAMs, load the tune with the flowsheet MAF and go for a good drive with lots of idle/cruise.

    Load your log into EA, filter out any bad data or open loop data and do the injector offset calcs (You'll have to load in your MAF and Injector Offset/Battery Voltage function in first). Load in the new changes, clear the KAMs and see how it goes.

    Wes
     
    #24
  5. Mustangless

    Mustangless New Member

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    changed my slopes to 42/44.94 and breakpoint 1.65999. I also changed my injector offset vs battery voltage to what yours is, and put in my maf transfer you sent me. (stanger007)

    Reset kams and drove for a while. Later when I got in I did a datalog. Put my info into EA and it said to change my High slope to 40.0964, keeping low the same. Avg kam was 1.0477, and low was 1. This was after filtering out OL and using 0-7000 rpms.


    I did the Injector Offset in EA and gave me some new numbers. Should I go ahead and change that too, or just go ahead and log with my new Inj. slopes?


    edit: Just saw where you said calculate offsets, not slopes. Should I change both still?
     
    #25
  6. Stanger007

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    The slopes you have look a bit tight, if you want to give mine a shot, they will work much better with the battery offset that I am using.

    Another good starting place is here: http://www.mustang-tech.org/wiki/94-95_Mustangs_Tuning_Injectors

    Either way, get your slopes/breakpoint/minimum pulsewidth set first (the low slope is used at idle) and then let EA calculate the battery offset for you. It will take a few drives to get it very close at idle.

    I started from the mustang-tech link above with mine and tuned it exactly with EA by logging a few drives.

    Wes
     
    #26
  7. Mustangless

    Mustangless New Member

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    I have not drove it yet, but I did reset the kams (don't know if I should have with just inj. slopes). Started it up and let it idle. Lamse was 14.xx in OL, the it went to CL, and it dropped to low 11s high 10s and went right back into OL. :shrug:

    Waited a while and it never went back to CL. So I restarted with hego dataloged and hego was going .0200,0.0300, 0.0400. finally it started showing real numbers .0.-.87ish then went into CL. Anyways the lambse was still at 11s, 10s but I did not do any driving yet.

    Does this sound like the o2 is dying? It has only been on there for 300 miles, after one with only 3k miles stopped working. :nonono:
     
    #27
  8. Mustangless

    Mustangless New Member

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    Just did a log after driving some. All what I have is bad news :nonono:

    1. Fans run more than I think they should (never noticed this, but they run alot). Looking under the hood I see some antifreeze on the drivers side radiator. Looking under the car (more about that in a second) and I see some on the turbo piping which is on the passenger side.

    2. Put the car in reverse and nothing, put it back in park and then reverse and it worked. MLPS probably needs adjusting.

    3. I was getting 0.02-.0.09 for my hego. I only saw CL for about 20 seconds out of 10 minutes or so. Looked under the car and it looked like it was still hooked up, but I could not see it really good. I am guessing this is why the car was running terrible too. Burned about a 1/4 driving 20 miles. :bs:

    :(
     
    #28
  9. Stanger007

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    What is your wideband gauge showing vs what the LAMBSEs are saying in Open Loop and in Closed Loop? That is going to be how you can determine of the O2 is giving you bad data.

    Do you have a radiator overflow tank? Head gaskets ok? It seems to be the week to blow headgaskets, another buddy of mine lost his.

    The car thinks it is running lean (from the O2) if it is commanding the LAMBSEs to be continually rich.

    I haven't watched O2 activity at startup, but once in closed loop they should be cycling back and forth as you noted.
     
    #29
  10. Mustangless

    Mustangless New Member

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    I hope its not a blown gasket, I have only seen 4lbs a couple of seconds this last week, no WOT. Looked at my dipstick yesterday and it was pure oil. My wideband was showing 10.7-11.3 during one of those runs. But I have not looked at the wideband since then. During that time the o2 seemed to be working right.

    I might get out later and look at the thing.

     
    #30
  11. BlackVert

    BlackVert Mustang Master

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    there is a bug in caledit when it save a maf transfer out to disk. you can see it if you simply save your transfer to a file and then immediately load in the file you just saved.

    i'd be very surprised if clint (the developer of EA and BE) doesn't know about it.

    there may also be a bug when it loads them, although it has been a while since i messed with that stuff.
     
    #31
  12. Mustangless

    Mustangless New Member

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    Found where the antifreeze is coming from. Its the where the line goes in about 5" below the cap.

    Pulled the hego out and replaced it with the one I though was messed up. It was still messed up, but I found my other one I had. It only has 1k miles on it.

    Pulled the drivers side header and fixed a leak. When I pulled the header it was white on the inside. Does this prove the car is lean?


    So, I think I can deal with my leaking radiator, for now atleast. But should I change something (injector slopes...or) so I am not lean? I think this is whey I have gone through 2 hegos in 500 miles.

    If you rev it, it starts popping when you let off too.
     
    #32
  13. Mustangless

    Mustangless New Member

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    Got a log in but, now I have more questions.

    When I calculate the offset with eec analyzer how do I know what numbers to put calcon or BE in? I don't have binary editor to look at right now, but EA gives me 34 different numbers, and calcon only has 12 spaces. :shrug:

    I have looked over the help parts, but don't see anything.
     
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  14. Stanger007

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    Input your current function then do the calculations. It'll spit out new numbers based off what you were running in the log.

    Wes
     
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  15. Mustangless

    Mustangless New Member

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  16. Mustangless

    Mustangless New Member

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    Put my info into ea and it said lower my high slope to 38.545 keep low the same and not change breakpoint.

    Did that and started the car. According to my lambse I was lean at idle so I changed my high to 48, which is lower.

    Just did a log after reseting and driving around. Now it is telling me to

    High 36.3982

    but keeping breakpoint and low the same.

    My avg kam was 1.05898, before it was 1.10


    Does this sound right? I would think you can only go so far away from the injector size. :shrug:
     
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  17. Stanger007

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    I would keep going with it. Like as not, something else in the tune or in the car is out of wack, but there are several ways to skin a cat with the tuning. You'll end up with the same results. Just watch your wideband at WOT to make sure you aren't going extremely rich or lean when it *really* matters.

    Be sure to back up what the narrowband O2 is telling you by checking the wideband as well.

    If you are within 3-5% on the fuel trims, I wouldn't worry to much about getting it any closer, the adaptive strategy is doing what it is there to do.

    Wes
     
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  18. Mustangless

    Mustangless New Member

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    made a few runs at the track with my new high slope 36.3978

    First run I was at 13.3 afr :notnice:

    Decided just to mess with my curve :nono:

    I did 10% increase from 10-30. Made another run and it was 12.2-12.6 :shrug:

    So then I richened it another 5% and went again, but my wide band stopped working.

    Car is running on the warmer side. I every time I come to a stop I hear the fans running. I have HS set to come on at 204 off at 200. When I did my second pass the ECT got to 220. So I turned them on at 196 off 192. That pass it got up to 216. I am thinking about getting a 180* t-stat. Maybe it is running hot because it is lean :shrug:

    On the injector offset I have not changed anything, but EA tells me to do this

    Volts Old New

    13.00 0.8437 0.9845
    14.00 0.7500 0.8747
    15.00 0.8437 0.8437
    15.94 0.8125 0.8125

    I did not want to changed that because I thought that it might make it run leaner.
     
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  19. Stanger007

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    Looks like you are mixing tuning the cruise and the WOT.

    The Battery/Injector Offset settings that EA is calculating for you will only be noticeable at idle and extremely light cruise. The new settings will be adding MORE fuel than the old. It thinks you are running LEAN.

    The WOT area it's perfectly normal to have to fudge the MAF a bit, you've got wildly different. I determined where to start richening the curve by looking at my datalog to see the kg/hr where I was in boost and went from there all the way up the curve.

    How much antifreeze vs water are you running? How does the overflow look after a run?

    Wes
     
    #39
  20. Mustangless

    Mustangless New Member

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    Well, my my part throttle and idle is about perfect atleast when it is in CL. I have not tried my new injector vs battery offset, so maybe that will help getting PT close to 1 for the kams.

    Did not check my overflow, and I think I am running 50/50 water antifreeze.
     
    #40

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