AFRs not all they're cracked up to be?
- Thread starter walker95svt
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DFG 5OH
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what do you mean not as great? They're a good head...are you just not making enough power with them? The 185's flow pretty good, and need the right intake/cam to get the full potential, but i guess that goes with any head 
Redsnk95
Founding Member
Yea defintely need some more information here on your set-up, and what the actual problem is that your having?
I've had a set of 185s, loved them, now have a set of 205s and love em even more.
Troy
I've had a set of 185s, loved them, now have a set of 205s and love em even more.
Troy
nmcgrawj
Advanced Member
walker95svt said:I own a set of AFR 185s, and don't think they are as great as touted by the magazine morons. just wanted to see what people thought about theirs, or other people's....
Any tuners want to take this one?
Any head can suck if its not the right package. It takes more than throwing a cam, heads, and intake together to make power. Those heads have been proven...outside of magazines. Post up your combo and explain what you dont like. I bet the pros here can help you.
I agree, don't make some blanket statement like that without posting why you feel that way and what your combo is. I LOVE mine...
Feels Slow As Hell
I wasn't really looking to seek others advice, just more to see what others thought. But if you guys're willing to go that route, that's cool too. here's the mod list.
331 CHP all forged, 14.2cc dished pistons (supposed to be 8.5:1, actually something like 9.4:1)
AFR 185s
1.6 comp rockers
comp blower cam, 223,224 dur-544-560 lift
stock cobra upper and lower
70mmtb
stock 24lbers with cobra mass air
shorty headers, off road h pipe, flowmasters...
all factory accessories
compression good on all cylinders
all kinds of stupid stuff, I don't think there's anything I'm missing that is ultra important in making power. Still awaiting a gear install, motor just got broken in, gear ratio is down to 2.95 because of tires, but it still felt barely faster than stock with smaller than stock tires and 3.08s (in case anyone wanted to go that route). I've got a blower in the box, just waiting on some injectors to come in. It just does not feel very much faster than stock. There are a lot of things that I know don't help, like all the accessories, stock pulleys, gear ratio, stock intake, and so on... but it just FEELS SLOW AS HELL. Yes, it's been tuned by dallas mustang.
I wasn't really looking to seek others advice, just more to see what others thought. But if you guys're willing to go that route, that's cool too. here's the mod list.
331 CHP all forged, 14.2cc dished pistons (supposed to be 8.5:1, actually something like 9.4:1)
AFR 185s
1.6 comp rockers
comp blower cam, 223,224 dur-544-560 lift
stock cobra upper and lower
70mmtb
stock 24lbers with cobra mass air
shorty headers, off road h pipe, flowmasters...
all factory accessories
compression good on all cylinders
all kinds of stupid stuff, I don't think there's anything I'm missing that is ultra important in making power. Still awaiting a gear install, motor just got broken in, gear ratio is down to 2.95 because of tires, but it still felt barely faster than stock with smaller than stock tires and 3.08s (in case anyone wanted to go that route). I've got a blower in the box, just waiting on some injectors to come in. It just does not feel very much faster than stock. There are a lot of things that I know don't help, like all the accessories, stock pulleys, gear ratio, stock intake, and so on... but it just FEELS SLOW AS HELL. Yes, it's been tuned by dallas mustang.
stangbanger94
New Member
just because it feels slow, doesn't mean it is slow. Go to the track then get back to us. Oh yeah, a blower cam with out a blower can make the car feel like a pig too 
The answer is quite simple. You built a VERY low compression blower engine with a blower spec cam with NO blower. Don't blame the cylinder head. You also have stock gears too? Get a blower on there, get a REAL exhaust, then get REAL injectors then have that place tune it and it'll do over 550hp.
nmcgrawj
Advanced Member
Ernie has a blower cam and gets good results. I dont know much about what makes it a "blower" cam and how it can affect it. But just thought i would throw that out there.
i think the unported intake might be holding you back a little too, but not enough to make it feel barely faster then stock
The exhaust is fine (and it's not fake), your injectors are okay for now. They are not fake either.
You can make plenty of power with a blower cam - N/A.
Now I think the question at hand is this: Obviously the gears make it seem a bit slower along with lower compression but what were you expecting anyways? A zo6 killer?...but what is your tune like? timing? spark plugs and their gap? maf? etc....
Unless you just added the heads and that is it to that existing combo how can you blame the entire think on the head?
The Cobra intake is not the problem in itself. Many guys make plenty of power with blown/cobra intake'd cars. groverdill is one...that ya'll may know. Others as well. duddor on corral...etc...etc. It isn't "just" the cobra intake
You can make plenty of power with a blower cam - N/A.
Now I think the question at hand is this: Obviously the gears make it seem a bit slower along with lower compression but what were you expecting anyways? A zo6 killer?...but what is your tune like? timing? spark plugs and their gap? maf? etc....
Unless you just added the heads and that is it to that existing combo how can you blame the entire think on the head?
The Cobra intake is not the problem in itself. Many guys make plenty of power with blown/cobra intake'd cars. groverdill is one...that ya'll may know. Others as well. duddor on corral...etc...etc. It isn't "just" the cobra intake
zenboy99
Founding Member
walker95svt said:I own a set of AFR 185s, and don't think they are as great as touted by the magazine morons. just wanted to see what people thought about theirs, or other people's....
Any tuners want to take this one?
What head with ~ 185cc intake runner is better?
For intake port size vs. flow, its hard to beat a set of AFR's. They really have their game together.
CNCd trick flow twisted wedge
and the cobra intake IS a problem this car is NA not blown. the intake can only allow as much air as it can flow N/A. at least port the damn lower!.
I expect the combo is probably making 315/345 ish right now isf you actually have 9.4, nothing outrageous. what were you expecting? and how do you get 9.4 from 8.5? did you mill your heads like .050?
and the cobra intake IS a problem this car is NA not blown. the intake can only allow as much air as it can flow N/A. at least port the damn lower!.
I expect the combo is probably making 315/345 ish right now isf you actually have 9.4, nothing outrageous. what were you expecting? and how do you get 9.4 from 8.5? did you mill your heads like .050?
There are other things hurting your performance which has nothing to do with the AFR 185's.
1. 3:08 gears. Though this has nothing to do with HP but gears increase acceleration. Highway gears with a 331 just doesn't work. Throw a 2.95 tranny gear and now your done.
2. Shorty headers. Now I'm knocking shorties what I'm saying is with AFR 185's shorties is a power robber. In fact 1 5/8 although OK wouldn't even be ideal in my opinion. I'm doing 1 3/4 Long tubes with my AFR 185's to get the best out of them.
3. Cobra intake. Again I'm not knocking this intake. Works great on N/A 302's. With the extra cubic inches you need to take advantage of it with something better. You mentioned it so you know.
4. 70MM Mass air. The stock meter is made for the stock 302. Throw some bolt on at it and that thing has to go. Add extra cubes and now it's a major restriction.
In a nut shell your induction and exhaust suck. Upgrade this stuff and add a real gear then we'll see.
1. 3:08 gears. Though this has nothing to do with HP but gears increase acceleration. Highway gears with a 331 just doesn't work. Throw a 2.95 tranny gear and now your done.
2. Shorty headers. Now I'm knocking shorties what I'm saying is with AFR 185's shorties is a power robber. In fact 1 5/8 although OK wouldn't even be ideal in my opinion. I'm doing 1 3/4 Long tubes with my AFR 185's to get the best out of them.
3. Cobra intake. Again I'm not knocking this intake. Works great on N/A 302's. With the extra cubic inches you need to take advantage of it with something better. You mentioned it so you know.
4. 70MM Mass air. The stock meter is made for the stock 302. Throw some bolt on at it and that thing has to go. Add extra cubes and now it's a major restriction.
In a nut shell your induction and exhaust suck. Upgrade this stuff and add a real gear then we'll see.
Wow!!
Thank you very much GRN92LX. I appreciate your "constructive" criticism. I can't wait to put gigantic injectors on my car. My exhaust is not the best, but my shorty headers and 2 1/2 in exhaust I'm sure are just fine for low 300s. Maybe just as fine for 300 as 24lb injectors. I was not expecting to go chase down helicopters and hayabusas, for those of you that think I'm ignorant. I'm sure my car leaves power on the table, as are most of you that are on your first motor that's only a couple months old. I was wanting around 270-300 flywheel out of my combo. I know what a 300hp car feels like, and this 331 does not quite get anywhere near there. Anyway, a 331 with heads and cam should outpower a stock cobra 302, at ANY gear ratio 1.31, or 4.10. Thank you everyone that gave me honest answers.
As far as my compression, my decks got redone, and that's my computation based on the pistons being 8 thousandths above the deck at top dead center. When asked, I usually just say mid nines, because of my lack of precision measuring equipment at the time. So, I think it's fair to assume my combo will be more driveable than a 8.5:1 car with the same deal.
Thank you very much GRN92LX. I appreciate your "constructive" criticism. I can't wait to put gigantic injectors on my car. My exhaust is not the best, but my shorty headers and 2 1/2 in exhaust I'm sure are just fine for low 300s. Maybe just as fine for 300 as 24lb injectors. I was not expecting to go chase down helicopters and hayabusas, for those of you that think I'm ignorant. I'm sure my car leaves power on the table, as are most of you that are on your first motor that's only a couple months old. I was wanting around 270-300 flywheel out of my combo. I know what a 300hp car feels like, and this 331 does not quite get anywhere near there. Anyway, a 331 with heads and cam should outpower a stock cobra 302, at ANY gear ratio 1.31, or 4.10. Thank you everyone that gave me honest answers.
As far as my compression, my decks got redone, and that's my computation based on the pistons being 8 thousandths above the deck at top dead center. When asked, I usually just say mid nines, because of my lack of precision measuring equipment at the time. So, I think it's fair to assume my combo will be more driveable than a 8.5:1 car with the same deal.
You say its been tuned by dallas mustang... I assume they tuned it with a wideband ON A DYNO. If not, how did they tune it, and if it was tuned on a dyno what numbers did it make.
I see three things I wonder about with that combo list.
1) You gotta be very close to the limit of those 24's!
2) I think the intake is too small.
3) This one is the big one IMHO .............
I pegged the stock maf with my combo which in no way, shape, or form should be able to move as much air as yours.
I'd go for 30's with bigger maf & intake.
Grady
1) You gotta be very close to the limit of those 24's!
2) I think the intake is too small.
3) This one is the big one IMHO .............
I pegged the stock maf with my combo which in no way, shape, or form should be able to move as much air as yours.
I'd go for 30's with bigger maf & intake.
Grady
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