HELP ON NO START? INPUT NEEDED

[hotcobra03]

helping a fellow on stangnet with pats problem,,,here is quick story..

someone tried to steal the car...wires were pulled out of steering column..

car was taking to ford....

ford finds 4 codes.and says that this car is a 1998 and we dont work on cars that old ...something about cant get parts? charges 130 bucks....

theft lite was flashing rapidly and no crank...


wires were fixed(he said he found a black wireunder dash that was spliced with 2 other wires--guess thats 3 wires spliced?) and theft lite proves out(from whats been told) MY guess is,, s205,, is the wire splice he found ?

car will crank....he says he pulls a plug and has spark at plug..

he says he has 12 volts on red wire on injector...

he says his fuel pump was changed ,,,but he claims his dad put in a pump that is used on a return system?

fuel filter has been changed and he claims the fuel will squiet high when schrader valve is pressed in....

he went to autozone and got a noid lite,,,,,he says light DID NOT light..


we all know its hard to do this over the net... he is on a super low budget,and is just learning...

just wondering what some of you guys might suggest to look at before going to far to fast,,,

THANKS

 

[hotcobra03]

injector test

i had him try this test with a test lite that i performed on my car as he was....


after checking for volts on the red wire...i had him hook the test lite to the positive of the battery and probe point into the ground wire on injector....

mine with test lite flicked brite once than to a flicker in the coil of the test lite bulb while cranking..


on his he claims the test light lit (bright and stayed lit)when he hooked his up this way,,but claims the noid didnt light?

would that say the pcm is grounding it but not changing the pulse? can the camshaft sensor be doing this ?

from what was read about pats ...it looked like fuel pump/injector oreation was on the same signal.....than ignition on another?

 

[squeak93]

Do the plugs smell of fuel?

Sounds like a timing issue of sorts.

It cranks, has spark and fuel.... All thats left is to time it all up.

 

[hotcobra03]

plugs

he says the plugs were very black(didnt metion wet)

he installed new plugs....


the car has been sitting close to a year now...

i had him ask some friends for a scanner to borrow...and to get a dvom,and its into pintest we go

been trying to get a copy of fords service manual to post up for others to install..

i did find a link and a guy on svtperformance was able to get in,,but just 1 guy..ive been trying to post my copy and my hard drive is to small..need 17g to copy and i got 13




SQUEAK93
whats your thought on pats? i see you read alot too,can pats turn on just fuel pump and not injectors?

THANKS

 

[squeak93]

There are two types of pats, I think mustangs have the first. Here is part of an article on it to better help. I have two keys that are not "programmed" but unlock the doors only, they will not even crank my motor. That tells me that pats has disabled the starter, not the injector pulse.

Ford passive anti-theft Systems (PATS) come in two configurations. The first takes away the ability to crank the engine over, using a starter interrupt relay to control the starter relay.

The second configuration allows the engine to crank, but takes the fuel injector pulse away.

(link: Ford Anti-Theft Systems Misunderstood)

 

[hotcobra03]

help

There are two types of pats, I think mustangs have the first. Here is part of an article on it to better help. I have two keys that are not "programmed" but unlock the doors only, they will not even crank my motor. That tells me that pats has disabled the starter, not the injector pulse.

Ford passive anti-theft Systems (PATS) come in two configurations. The first takes away the ability to crank the engine over, using a starter interrupt relay to control the starter relay.

The second configuration allows the engine to crank, but takes the fuel injector pulse away.

(link: Ford Anti-Theft Systems Misunderstood)

thats for the link,,will read it

ive found alot on pats,,from ford and other links

he does have a bypass kit if we dont get it going,,,

i also have a spare for my cobra that only lets you play radio and lower windows...

if i try to start my car with key ,,cel comes on po1260..this dude needs a scanner bad...that should tell him if pats passed?????????

after talking with him last nite,,it looks like he might have lost spark on 1 of the coil packs,,I also asked about the broken wire again..he says it was black and was connected to the ignition switch,,than was tyed into the instrument panel? i looked in wire diagram and found,,,,A1 is black /lg and should be 12volts and i dont see it going to instrument panel,,,than on pats tranciever i see a black/w wire for ground,,that didnt lead to panel,,waiting on a close-up pitcure of wire

THANKS again

hey he told me he got a book and wire diagrams for auto zone...i remember seeing a post with the pitcure of the mistake on wires...cant find it ,,do you remember?

 

[squeak93]

F autozone wiring diagrams (at least the web site ones, the books should be ok). They are wrong about 1/2 the time. I chased ghost for 4 days and almost pulled a motor b/c they had the firing order wrong on their site for 96-98's.

With that said, how does he know a wire from a cp goes to the instrument panel? they are in a HUGE loom and he'd have to take it and the dash apart to ensure it just doesn't go to the puter/fuse panel or elsewhere. There should be no wire that does such a thing to my knowledge.

I am not sure what thread your talking about.

 

[hotcobra03]

started

thanks squeak93....hey the member i was helping,,RADODREAMS...he had a friend go over it with him,,

that link was good reading,,,i have one from ford with a story of pats being bad and car still starting....guess this system is strange


his email and pic

One of my buddies that knows his way around cars ended up coming over yesterday and i explained everything to him and he says''ok lets try to disarm the alarm to see if that will work''.He read online how to do it on a mustang and he wasnt getting a theft light then he said''something is wrong im not getting a theft light so i can disarm your system'', I then replaced the pats module and the theft light came on but i told him if i change that module i have to reprogram my key,he said ''thats fine''.The theft light came on and he said ''theres your problem,your module is fried because its not throwing a theft light to even reprogram the keys.Out of curiosity and not believing he figured out whats wrong with it within 2 hours i opened the module and one of the connectors was popped,it had a little gap inbetween a connector.He reconnected the module put a screwdriver inbetween the gap and i tried to start it an it fired right up then i looked at him in disbelieve


Im the happiest guy alive right now,you have been way way mre than helpfull i appreciate everything that you have helped me with thank you,If you are curious ill send you a pic of the part that was fried...........

 

[squeak93]

Thats an odd one. Esp the fact that he could SEE the fried wire in the module. Glad he got it fixed!