smog pump question

[HISSIN50]

Justin, I am confused now. I dont know who is running what, or postulating about whatever else.

You know my stand - that stupid pump is needed. BTW, yours is running like a champ - it's so quiet that I can now hear my squealing tensioner pulley (picked up a new metal one today).

From the top: the AIR pump sends air to the back of the heads at start up for a couple mins. After that, it is all going to the cats. We can see that latter component is important IMHO (if someone wanted to only vent the smog pump to the cats - omitting the heads, I see little issue there). The other way around is a big no-go IMHO.

But we can see that I am still up in the air about aftermarket cats.

Another thought: some cars dont have an air pump but have cats. Now I dont know if the pump (in those cases) was omitted because the car already ran pretty clean or what.
Or with the dirty 5.0L, was the pump necessary to simply clean up every last bit of air. From what I have read from smog manufacturers, it seems that air does help, across the board. Is it necessary to get the most life out of the cats? I think so. How much will the life of the aftermarket cat be shortened if no pump is used? Who knows (that depends upon tune a lot, IMHO). The pump can clean up a rich condition that would otherwise take out a cat pretty quick (with no pump), it seems to me. Take that for what anyone will.

I have had cars with no pump and cats and the converters did alright, I guess. Where I live, it is a non-issue - I keep all that stuff on there for yearly inspections (I am too lazy to swap a pipe and fart around with lame bypassing of the pump which doesnt work too well for some, etc).

Glad I could muddy that issue more than it was already.

 

[HISSIN50]

They are magnaflow cats,they are a good cats.If there was a clogging problem if no smog pump was present,then they would have made hook ups for the cats!! No?

As you can tell from my last post (I was typing while you posted), I cant say with any amount of reason. Honestly, I would contact Magnaflow and get their opinion. You raise a good point about that, though I would have expected their cats to come with a fitting [on a pipe that is application specific (OEM had a pipe and people who runs cats generally have all their smog stuff............)]. But since you run their product, who better to ask? It is about a ton better than asking me.

As you can see, I am as curious about peoples' experiences and thoughts about this as anyone - it's not a heated debate of any sort (we just want to get to the bottom of it!).

If you do contact them, let us know what they say.

Oh, I am confused about your plumbing (sounds kinda custom). One thing I would do (if you dont have it planned) is to keep the check valve in place. It protects the pump in case of a backfire.

Good luck bud.

 

[SeventyMach1]

Ahh ... we're all kinda on the same note now. I was forgetting that he was using aftermarket cats (& was thinking of our "smog pump needed" stock cats).

You would think the Magnaflow's could do without, since they didn't come with the provision for a smog tube ..... but who knows? Maybe, as JT hit on, they can do without the smog stuff on a clean running engine ..... and maybe even on our nasty 5.0's.

 

[willys1]

I will call them tonight as long as there still open.I will post my findings.
No way in hell this is a heated debate! Im thankful for your reply's...

 

[GNN60GT500]

Hey Magnaflow guy here-

Well who ever put your X pipe together did not use the proper converters- they should have used our converters with air-

They need to use the converters with air tube for your vehicle- 87-93 fox body-

If you blow on a fire, it will get hotter, and thats what the air does, it helps to heat the converter to help with the oxidation process of the hydrcarbons-


I would not drill a tube into the converter, because you will superheat the portion of the ceramic substrate where the tube sticks in which may result in premature converter failure or excessive wear in that spot-

THanks
Brent

 

[willys1]

Hey Magnaflow guy here-

Well who ever put your X pipe together did not use the proper converters- they should have used our converters with air-

They need to use the converters with air tube for your vehicle- 87-93 fox body-

If you blow on a fire, it will get hotter, and thats what the air does, it helps to heat the converter to help with the oxidation process of the hydrcarbons-


I would not drill a tube into the converter, because you will superheat the portion of the ceramic substrate where the tube sticks in which may result in premature converter failure or excessive wear in that spot-

THanks
Brent

Thanks Brent Actually I just got off the phone with magnaflow.He said they make them with and with out the hose fitting.(so the place I ordered it from sent me the wrong one ) It wont have any clogging issues,but If I did put on a fitting to the EXHAUST pipe it would void the warrenty!! So now the question is if it will hurt the smog equipment/engine in the long run!!? (with it blowing air,not hooked up to anything)

 

[SeventyMach1]

So now the question is if it will hurt the smog equipment/engine in the long run!!? (with it blowing air,not hooked up to anything)

That's a definite "NO" ...... I don't see how anything could mess up if it's just blowing, but not hooked up. You may get some unwanted noise, though. If I were you .... I'd just take it off. But it's up to you.

So did Magnaflow say that the cats you were sent would light up & work okay without the smog stuff?

 

[willys1]

That's a definite "NO" ...... I don't see how anything could mess up if it's just blowing, but not hooked up. You may get some unwanted noise, though. If I were you .... I'd just take it off. But it's up to you.

So did Magnaflow say that the cats you were sent would light up & work okay without the smog stuff?

Yeah you "can" hear it..Im thinkin of running it up to the inside the passenger fender rite by the air filter on the end of my power pipe wonder if its cold air all the time blowing out ?!!

 

[5.0 Nostalgia]

The pressure coming from the smog pump is minimal and would result in little to no hp gain. Plus if you pump is old, it is probably pumping dirty air out of it.

 

[willys1]

The pressure coming from the smog pump is minimal and would result in little to no hp gain. Plus if you pump is old, it is probably pumping dirty air out of it.

I was kidding!! Hissin do you think it will be OK?
(Disconnected hose)

 

[HISSIN50]

I was kidding!! Hissin do you think it will be OK?
(Disconnected hose)

If discussing having the smog pump hooked-up but the hose is attached to nothing (except maybe your CAI ), I agree with Justin. I might even put a resonator of sorts on the end of the hose (at least a filter) to keep moisture out of the pump internals.

I am still confused about the cats (I understand your SNAFU with the wrong ones), but I kinda wonder if Magnaflow's cats could withstand no air injection (thinking about it now, it might be hard to get an answer since the party-line will be to say to keep the OEM A.I.R. system functional).

Brent kinda hit on some of this, but again I am confused. Brent, do you use Magnaflow components, or are you affiliated with the company?

 

[5.0 Nostalgia]

I was kidding!! Hissin do you think it will be OK?
(Disconnected hose)

I thought so, but many have come on here with serious intentions of trying to do it.

 

[willys1]

If discussing having the smog pump hooked-up but the hose is attached to nothing (except maybe your CAI ), I agree with Justin. I might even put a resonator of sorts on the end of the hose (at least a filter) to keep moisture out of the pump internals.

I am still confused about the cats (I understand your SNAFU with the wrong ones), but I kinda wonder if Magnaflow's cats could withstand no air injection (thinking about it now, it might be hard to get an answer since the party-line will be to say to keep the OEM A.I.R. system functional).

Brent kinda hit on some of this, but again I am confused. Brent, do you use Magnaflow components, or are you affiliated with the company?

Yeah they will.The guy told me they use them both ways,with and "without" air pumps and they never had a clogging issue..

 

[HISSIN50]

Yeah they will.The guy told me they use them both ways,with and "without" air pumps and they never had a clogging issue..

Sweet. Thanks for the info. Ya know, I have an aftermarket catted H on the '94, and I bet if I went without the pump for about 10 mins, they would melt down (my luck).

Anyhow, thanks for sharing the info.

BTW, the only way introducing the smog-pump air into the intake and have it make any power, is to run the air through a flux inverter before it hits the intake. The resulting gradient barometer delta makes it worthwhile.

 

[willys1]

Sweet. Thanks for the info. Ya know, I have an aftermarket catted H on the '94, and I bet if I went without the pump for about 10 mins, they would melt down (my luck).

Anyhow, thanks for sharing the info.

BTW, the only way introducing the smog-pump air into the intake and have it make any power, is to run the air through a flux inverter before it hits the intake. The resulting gradient barometer delta makes it worthwhile.

Actually think about it,,that hose has to have some strong pressure for #1 for me to hear it so clearly over my Bassani Muffs ,and #2 it has to pump into an exhaust pipe of a running motor,if it had no pressure what difference would it make?


and #3 its belt driven off the motor!!

 

[HISSIN50]

Actually think about it,,that hose has to have some strong pressure for #1 for me to hear it so clearly over my Bassani Muffs ,and #2 it has to pump into an exhaust pipe of a running motor,if it had no pressure what difference would it make?


and #3 its belt driven off the motor!!

I dont normally correlate noise to positive pressure. All that matters is that you cant get anywhere near the volume of air needed, nor at any significant pressure, to make a difference with induction.
If you had a pump that was belt driven (#3) that moved a good volume of air (A/R relationship, etc) and could provide some pressure (say .5 bar), that would work. Problem is that they look like snails and cost a pretty penny.

 

[willys1]

I dont normally correlate noise to positive pressure. All that matters is that you cant get anywhere near the volume of air needed, nor at any significant pressure, to make a difference with induction.
If you had a pump that was belt driven (#3) that moved a good volume of air (A/R relationship, etc) and could provide some pressure (say .5 bar), that would work. Problem is that they look like snails and cost a pretty penny.

,,,,,,

 

[GNN60GT500]

Hey sorry it took me some time to respond, I was on a sales trip- but to answer your questions-

I actually work for Magnaflow- and I use the products on my own cars before I started working here-

Not having the smog pump hooked up will not do anything in my own experience, it just makes the noise-

From an emmissions stand point, the converters will not work as well because the CPU is programmed to run slightly rich on fox bodies because it factors in for the extra air will be helping to increase heat and burn up the excess HCs in the converter-

So no it wont do anything to harm your car, it just wont do as well on a sniffer test-

 

[HISSIN50]

Hey sorry it took me some time to respond, I was on a sales trip- but to answer your questions-

I actually work for Magnaflow- and I use the products on my own cars before I started working here-

Not having the smog pump hooked up will not do anything in my own experience, it just makes the noise-

From an emmissions stand point, the converters will not work as well because the CPU is programmed to run slightly rich on fox bodies because it factors in for the extra air will be helping to increase heat and burn up the excess HCs in the converter-

So no it wont do anything to harm your car, it just wont do as well on a sniffer test-

Thank you for the reply. I have to say that I am a little surprised that having no A.I.R. injection doesn't shorten the life of the aftermarket cats. Very good info to have around.

BTW, do you have pics of the cars in your sig? Looks like a couple of fun ones.

 

[willys1]

Hey sorry it took me some time to respond, I was on a sales trip- but to answer your questions-

I actually work for Magnaflow- and I use the products on my own cars before I started working here-

Not having the smog pump hooked up will not do anything in my own experience, it just makes the noise-

From an emmissions stand point, the converters will not work as well because the CPU is programmed to run slightly rich on fox bodies because it factors in for the extra air will be helping to increase heat and burn up the excess HCs in the converter-

So no it wont do anything to harm your car, it just wont do as well on a sniffer test-

Thanks I like the product (Magnaflow) cars performs and sounds pretty hot!!