In comparison wich is better the 351 cleavland or windsor? my friend has a windsor up for grabs and ive been thinking about a 351 swap for some time now. As well i was also wondering. What would be needed to mate everything to that motor? Will everything just bolt up or do i need other parts. If anyone has done this before your advice is appreceated thanks
351 swap
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Vipersix
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There are all sorts of threads available for this topic if you do a search.
The quick and dirty: The Windsor is going to be cheaper and easier to build than the Cleveland due to a larger availability of parts and greater compatibility with the 289/302 series engines.
The quick and dirty: The Windsor is going to be cheaper and easier to build than the Cleveland due to a larger availability of parts and greater compatibility with the 289/302 series engines.
I'd love to build a badass Cleveland but they're pretty expensive and you can build just as much power with a Windsor.
93 LX
Founding Member
Cool Link however the firing order on 5.0L HO and 351W is the same from the years 82 to 93 on Fox chassis Mustang and Capri's...
Allen
I would agree with that, Allen.
If you see something that doesn't seem right, please feel free to quote it in a post here.
I would love the opportunity to make a correction to any errors I have made
jason
SuperStang83
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h8my408
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i put a stock windsor from a bronco in my '82.
only had to do a carb conversion, so i chose edelbrock to help me out with that, with a performer rpm II top end kit.
i never installed the heads or the cam, but i used the air gap intake manifold, and i am running pretty hard. with the stock rearend i'm around the low 13 second range... i havent figured out how to not spin the first two gears yet...
if i could launch the car, i imagine i could get a pretty quick time, maybe high 12's.. and with the heads and cam, i should be in the 450hp range at the crank...
this top end kit cost $2200 if i remember correctly... i would highly suggest the 351 because of it's aftermarket following being nearly as strong as the 5.0.. flip through your MM&FF mag and count the parts for the clevlands... i dont think you'll be able to count on both hands!
only had to do a carb conversion, so i chose edelbrock to help me out with that, with a performer rpm II top end kit.
i never installed the heads or the cam, but i used the air gap intake manifold, and i am running pretty hard. with the stock rearend i'm around the low 13 second range... i havent figured out how to not spin the first two gears yet...
if i could launch the car, i imagine i could get a pretty quick time, maybe high 12's.. and with the heads and cam, i should be in the 450hp range at the crank...
this top end kit cost $2200 if i remember correctly... i would highly suggest the 351 because of it's aftermarket following being nearly as strong as the 5.0.. flip through your MM&FF mag and count the parts for the clevlands... i dont think you'll be able to count on both hands!
Have to say I have not had any trouble finding Cleveland parts cheaply. I like both motors actually and have both but there are pros/cons to both. 351C 4V heads are monsters stock, stock crank/rods are good to between 5-600 hp. No oil mods are needed unless you plan on routinely going past 6500 rpm. Aftermarket parts from great companies are becoming much more common(CHI or AFD for example) 2V heads are cheap and will support up to 500 hp and will have better low end response with their smaller ports. The 4V heads can be a tad logey down low but for the most part that is overstated, however once the rpms climb, watch out!
351W are pretty easy to find and were made for many more years than the 351Cs so theres lots more motors/parts around. I think 69s are the strongest block and 93-95s are the roller blocks. Was reading a couple threads on here today about people getting really nice numbers off of 408 stroker motors. You do need aftermarket heads though, stock won't cut it like on a Cleveland. I am going serpentine/fuel injected on my Cleveland and thats a hassle, much easier on a Windsor. Either way, a nicely set up 351X in a fox is fun as hell to drive and worth building!
Matt
351W are pretty easy to find and were made for many more years than the 351Cs so theres lots more motors/parts around. I think 69s are the strongest block and 93-95s are the roller blocks. Was reading a couple threads on here today about people getting really nice numbers off of 408 stroker motors. You do need aftermarket heads though, stock won't cut it like on a Cleveland. I am going serpentine/fuel injected on my Cleveland and thats a hassle, much easier on a Windsor. Either way, a nicely set up 351X in a fox is fun as hell to drive and worth building!
Matt
Sounds like a lotta ppl have done this before. Whats the stock hp to tq rating on these things? the motor's out of a 69 torino that hasnt ran in a while. doesnt matter though it is for free. I spun the crank today and it still has compression in all the spk plug inserts. I know this isnt an accurate way of testing compression but at least their was compression. anything else i could test or look for before going ahead with this? thanks
If its free definitely worth tearing apart to make sure the block is usable, especially since its a 69 block (if original of course). At the very least I'd pull the heads to check cylinder walls and a couple main/rod caps to check bearings before you ran it but personally my first stop would be at a machine shop after I stripped the block down.
I want to do this this summer too, I have NO experience with anything like this though...think I could do it with the help of some friends and family that know a little? I don't think I have the budget for a top end kit atm nor am I sure I would need that power as I'm still getting used to the 5.0. Will I be happy with a well running stock 351 is I can manage to do it?
Congrats on the 69 Torino block
That is a good find!
The Cleveland heads can work on a 351w...
But some work will need to be done... it may not be worth the cost...
I don't remember the details, but it was outlined in the older FRPP Racing catalogs.
I wouldn't use Cleveland heads just so that I could use some Cleveland headers...
I doubt those headers will fit the Mustang anyway...
just my thoughts,
jason
Thanks man. Your information was very helpfull. while reading i came across info that stated you can use headers off the 302 for the 351. Is this true? i have bbk shorty e/l that i'd like to put on. since longtubes wont fit. would the bbk's do the trick? also only thing needed for the swap would be an oil pump, oil pan and fuel bigger fuel rails?? thats crazy! thats almost tooo easy. i'd also like opinions on leaving it carb or switching to f/i . i no carb is easyer to pump those extra horses out just by slappin a 4brl on it. but in the long run whats best bet?
How much power you make will depend on how well it is tuned, not on whether its efi or carb.
Go with what you are most comfortable with.
You will need to swap intake manifolds as well.
302 headers won't work due to the increased width/height of the 351w.
jason
Go with what you are most comfortable with.
You will need to swap intake manifolds as well.
302 headers won't work due to the increased width/height of the 351w.
jason
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