1991 331 stroker trick flow, will not run good

R

real57vetteguy

New Member
Nov 17, 2009
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#1
Guys,

Hi and great forum! I have a 1991 Mustang that has the following mods:
331 DSS stroker
Trick flow street heat heads
1.6 roller rockers
trick flow R series intake
70 MM throttle body & C&L 70 MM Mass air
X-303 cam
BBK full length headers
off road x pipe
flowmaster exhaust (single chamber)
underdrive pulleys
alum 4 core radiator
elec fan
24 lb injectors which is correctly matched to the mass air
msd distributor
msd 6AL box

These are all the engine mods that I know of. The car runs terribly rich at idle you can smell fuel at idle, and at higher rpm's it runs very lean. The car feels stronger than a stock can but no where near as strong as it should be, it has alot of seemingly fuel issues if you stay at low rpm's in town then it tends to pop and crack as if it were a carb vehicle that were "loading" up on fuel. The computer is stock to my knowledge. My use for the car is mainly to drive on weekends on cruises, and some occasional trips to the track. I am not a fan of the X-cam so I have went and purchased the trick flow stage 2 cam and an adjustible fuel pressure regualtor but I dont think this is a total fix. Any help or suggestions guys??
 

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#2
get a custom chip burned immediately. have it towed to a dyno shop.

running too lean will wash out the rings, and glaze the cylinder walls. running too lean will cause detonation and kaboom.

the problem is not the cam. the x cam is a stronger cam than a TFS stage 2.

the problem u have is in the tune.
 
#4
Good advice, I would like your input on my thinking about the Cam swap, The X-cam seems to make more high end horsepower, even some that is un-useable with a stock rev limiter, my thoughts were that number one the trick flow cam would be better matched to the heads/intake I have and would have better mid range power, or quite posiblyI just wasted alot of money and labor. Thanks for the advice though, do you think the 6AL box is useful or should I switch back to stock? also the alum radiator has no overflow and I would like to add a nice looking functional one any suggestions?
 
#5
Dump the codes and fix any codes that pop up before spending money on a custom tune. There is no point in band aiding problems caused by faulty sensors and wiring.

Dumping The computer diagnostic codes on 86-95 Mustangs

Revised 19-May-2009 to update drawing for dumping the codes on 86-88 Mustangs with no check engine light.

Dump the codes and see what the computer says is wrong…Codes may be present in the computer even if the Check Engine light isn’t on.

Here's the way to dump the computer codes with only a jumper wire or paper clip and the check engine light, or test light or voltmeter. I’ve used it for years, and it works great. You watch the flashing test lamp or Check Engine Light and count the flashes.

Be sure to turn off the A/C, and put the transmission in neutral when dumping the codes. Fail to do this and you will generate a code 67 and not be able to dump the Engine Running codes.

Dumping the Engine Running codes: The procedure is the same, you start the engine with the test jumper in place. Be sure the A/C is off and the transmission is in neutral. You'll get an 11, then a 4 and the engine will speed up to do the EGR test. After the engine speed decreases back to idle, it will dump the engine running codes.

Here's the link to dump the computer codes with only a jumper wire or paper clip and the check engine light, or test light or voltmeter. I’ve used it for years, and it works great. You watch the flashing test lamp or Check Engine Light and count the flashes.

See Troublcodes.net Trouble Codes OBD & OBD2 Trouble Codes and Technical info & Tool Store. By BAT Auto Technical

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If your car is an 86-88 stang, you'll have to use the test lamp or voltmeter method. There is no functional check engine light on the 86-88's except possibly the Cali Mass Air cars.

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The STI has a gray connector shell and a white/red wire. It comes from the same bundle of wires as the self test connector.

89 through 95 cars have a working Check Engine light. Watch it instead of using a test lamp.

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The STI has a gray connector shell and a white/red wire. It comes from the same bundle of wires as the self test connector.


WARNING!!! There is a single dark brown connector with a black/orange wire. It is the 12 volt power to the under the hood light. Do not jumper it to the computer test connector. If you do, you will damage the computer.

What to expect:
You should get a code 11 (two single flashes in succession). This says that the computer's internal workings are OK, and that the wiring to put the computer into diagnostic mode is good. No code 11 and you have some wiring problems.

Codes have different answers if the engine is running from the answers that it has when the engine isn't running. It helps a lot to know if you had the engine running when you ran the test.

Trouble codes are either 2 digit or 3 digit, there are no cars that use both 2 digit codes and 3 digit codes.

Alternate methods:
For those who are intimidated by all the wires & connections, see Actron® for what a typical hand scanner looks like. Normal retail price is about $30 or so at AutoZone or Wal-Mart.

Or for a nicer scanner see Digital Ford Code Reader (3145) – It has a 3 digit LCD display so that you don’t have to count flashes or beeps.. Cost is $30.
 
#6
OK. but dumping the codes does not fix them. he needs someone to read the codes, fix them and tune the engine.

the tuner can dump the codes and fix them usually on the spot. forget the MSD box, use the stock ignition and dizzy.

The street heat heads r the TFS high ports. The HP's r a great head, especially ported and that R is a great intake. I would use a OTB comp cam XE282HR. The TFS stage 2 is similar to comp cam XE274HR, I had one and was not impressed. The x cam does not have enough lift and duration at .542 and 224. u need more like .560-.575 and 230/240 with a 108lc.
 
#7
like said above, its a simple fix, IT NEEDS TUNED. you cant build a 331 and expect the stock computer to know what the hells going on.
 
#8
I had my 347 stroker for 4 years before it got a custom chip. it ran great. when the chip was done, I picked up 20rwhp and 15rwtq. The OP issue is different, his engine is running rich.
 
#13
Before you go nuts trying to chase down the problem, there's something simple I would try. Seeing as how you have a C&L meter and what you are describing is not unheard of with them, did you try clocking the meter? Try turning the meter an "hour" at a time and take a short ride and see if you get better. C&L combined with a cold air intake can cause some real drivability hickups.
 
#14
re

pissed pardon the language but boy i am mad We put the new cam in went through the motor and timed it tried to fire it and nothing, I suspected timing issues before the cam change and was told because of the x cam it was related to to computer, well now tells the tell. for the second time you cant time this motor even with the new cam, timing chain and lifters. on ten degrees it will not turn over on 14 barly I think DSS made a big mistake on their crank keyway
 
#15
RE

Tonight we try it again, I am not 100% sure the keyway is off. I am sure that there is something serious going on, the car at TDC ,10 degree timing, chip out of the distributor will not crank and turns over slowly as if the timing were advanced. This was an issue before the cam change, the car seemed to run best at about 40 degrees timing and not run at all at 10 degrees, I had assumed that when we change the cam we will find something timing chain wise etc but no issues found. Any ideas????
 
#16
re

Tonight after going back through everything double checking valve adjustment, timing, finding TDC etc etc we finally got the motor to crank but it has a terrible pop and cracking, also seems to be poping back through the intake, I have considered the possibility of the MSD 6AL box giving problems, does anyone else have any ideas? it seems to be getting plenty of fuel, the pressure is around 34 psi, the timing is at 10 degrees with the chip out and with it in the timing is jumping all over, I am not sure what to do.
 
#19
once again

Ok again tonight I went back in, readjusted the valves to make sure adjustment was correct, checked timing, found compression stroke, pulled TDC with a piston stop and the balancer was 1/16 on an inch from the 0 degree mark so close enough. dropped the distributor in pointing right at number one plug wire on the rotor cap, the firing order is correct per cam card (new trick flow stage 2 cam) fire the motor, i have to feather the throttle, we set the timing to ten degrees lots of poping and cracking like its 180 out but its not. I did discover A crack in the plastic bracket on the distributor where the wiring harness plugs into the distributor?
 
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