MAF question...

Discussion in 'Fox 5.0 Mustang Tech' started by ratio411, Apr 13, 2013.


  1. 88LX5.Oh

    88LX5.Oh Advanced Member

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    http://www.stangnet.com/2002/01/23/mustang-mass-air-conversion/

    #21
  2. ratio411

    ratio411 Founding Member

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    Do you plan on running an aftermarket cam?
    SD is actually better than MAF, but you have to run a stock cam or an aftermarket cam with a smooth idle.
    If you don't intend to use a cam with any sort of rough idle, there is really no need to go MAF.
    SD can handle anything you can throw at it other than a rough idle.
    Just a heads up.
    Swapping to MAF is easy enough though.
    #22
  3. ratio411

    ratio411 Founding Member

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    My opinion on your friend's offer, not knowing exactly what he has of course....

    MAF, you need one, but the stock Fox MAF is junk. No value there if he is offering a stock Fox MAF.
    The SN95 style MAF is much better and easy to swap into a Fox.

    CAI... They are the same between SD and MAF, except the SD setups usually come with a spacer tube to go in place of the MAF. If you have an SD CAI with this tube, you can just swap the MAF into it's place.

    Harness: If you know how to insert new wires into the ECM plug and can follow a diagram, then all you need is a pigtail harness. RJM has them for 30-40 bux if memory serves. RJM is your friend if you want a wide selection of harness parts/adapters to mod your car.

    ECM: You don't need a "chip", you need to replace your SD ECM with a MAF ECM.
    If you buddy has a good A9L, then it's worth about 100 bux. You can buy them reconditioned from Adavance or AZ for about that. If it is not an A9L equivalent, you should hold out for the A9L or equivalent. They have the best tuning. So it all depends on exactly which ECM he is offering to know if there is any value there.

    There is no difference in TBs between SD and MAF. So if he is offering a STOCK TB, no value there.
    If he is offering an aftermarket TB, there might be a little value there. Also a properly modded Explorer 65mm TB would have some slight value, however they are very easily aquired, inexpensive, and easy to convert to Fox use.

    So, if he has a pile of stock leftovers, he doesn't offer much value other than just getting you driving.
    If he has the right parts, it could be a good thing, but you have to know what you are getting.
    #23
  4. Gearhead92

    Gearhead92 Member

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    He is offering me two deals:
    BBK 70mm throttle body, EGR plate, and A9L chip for $175
    or
    Accufab (spelled that right?) 65mm Throttle body with EGR delete, a custom fabricated upper intake manifold that he got from La Roccas Performance in NJ, and the A9L chip for $375

    I just read some awful reviews and forums about this shop, but he said he ran a blower and this intake on his 91GT, pushing 19psi and had no issues.
    #24
  5. jrichker

    jrichker StangNet's favorite TOOL SN Certified Technician Founding Member

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    Of all the things discussed in this post, this is the thing to avoid doing. The air filter sucks up hot, turbulent engine air, causing problems getting the MAF to measure airflow correctly. This turns into performance/driveability problems like surging idle and flat spots in acceleration. The stock airbox with a K&N flat panel filter is light years better than this
    #25
  6. Gearhead92

    Gearhead92 Member

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    Since you mentioned surging idle. With a Speed density set up, I just have a short ram with a cone filter sitting next to my alternator. Would that cause a un-smooth idle?

    I also have cold engine issues. She loves to hesitate like crazy the first 10/15 mins she runs. If I give it any amount of gas over just being able to barely accelerate, it just hangs. Eventually it will open up.
    #26
  7. jrichker

    jrichker StangNet's favorite TOOL SN Certified Technician Founding Member

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    The Speed Density setups are not so critical since there isn't a MAF to confuse. However, sucking up warm air from the engine compartment isn't a good way to get maximum performance from an engine. EFI engines love the cold air you get with the stock airbox and flat panel filter.

    See the "Surging Idle Checklist” for help with all your idle/stall problems. You can guess at the problem and throw parts at it, or you can use the checklist to help you find the problem quickly and inexpensively. The checklist is right here in the Stangnet 5.0 Tech forum and you don’t have navigate to some other unknown web site. It‘s free and doesn’t cost anything: at last count there were more than 103,000 visits and still climbing

    The quick and easy way to dump the codes is in there too, and all you need to do it is a paper clip! The first two posts contain all the fixes & updates. At last count there were 24 possible causes and fixes for surging idle/stall problems. I continue to update it as more people post fixes or ask questions.
    #27
  8. Gearhead92

    Gearhead92 Member

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    It is strange because it is only when it's cold. And I replaced and adjusted the TPS. I'll use the checklist. thanks
    #28
  9. Gearhead92

    Gearhead92 Member

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    Anyone have an opinion on this previous post of mine?
    #29
  10. James.Little

    James.Little Member

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    Personally I would take the first deal for $175, only because A9L's run (on eBay) for about ~$100-180 and you get a larger TB. You could always look up these parts and see what they run and make your own assessment on which is a better deal or which deal fits more towards your needs.

    However you said that shop did crap work and it is a "custom" intake manifold, you might be better off not taking that deal, but I could be wrong here.
    #30
  11. ratio411

    ratio411 Founding Member

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    You can get the ECM from Autozone or Advance for right about $100.
    (You keep saying "chip", and we are assuming you mean ECM. Make sure he isn't really talking about a "chip", that won't help you one bit. You need the ECM...)
    You don't need anything else he is selling, to do the swap.
    My son got a real nice Stacks Racing 75mm TB on sale for $117 shipped.
    I think the sale ended, but they are commonplace, if you really want a TB.
    You already have an EGR plate, and don't need the delete for the conversion alone.
    #31
  12. ratio411

    ratio411 Founding Member

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    Think about this:
    Whatever problems you have now, converting to MAF is not going to fix a thing. You will still have problems.
    An SD system will run great when it's in tune, just like the MAF will run bad when you have problems you don't fix.
    Make sense?
    If you decide to go to a MAF conversion, you should only do it AFTER you get the car running right again.
    If you do the MAF conversion first, and your car continues to run badly, you won't know what symptoms are from whatever was already broken, and if any are from the mods you just did. Nothing will be fixed by the conversion, and you stand a chance of making things worse.
    #32
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  13. Gearhead92

    Gearhead92 Member

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    Both of these, price wise, are great deals. That I have checked on. It is the specific parts that I am curious about, mainly the upper intake manifold. From what I've read, the shop does crappy tunes currently, but used to have a good rep. Since this is a part, and not a tune, along with this guy running 19psi through it, sounds pretty solid to me. But I'm still in the decision making process.
    I know both Accufab and BBK have good reputations, at least from what I have read.

    I plan on getting it tuned soon. I know the timing is off, and the tps could use an adjustment.

    I'd like to take it to a shop that knows how to tune it. But not sure what shops are around Baltimore or Harrisburg, since I'm in the middle of the two.
    Then I'd work on the MAF conversion.

    Yes, it is the ECM. He has sent me pictures of it.

    I know I don't need the delete. But I've read and been told that the EGR is part of the emissions system, which I could care less about. I've also heard some horror stories about people blowing a motor
    because of the antifreeze that runs through the EGR, somehow was responsible for causing issues in one of the rear cylinders. I don't know the specifics, but if that is possible, and it is just emissions, then I don't want it.

    Whether or not it can cause issues, if it isn't necessary, I don't see the point to keep it.

    If I'm wrong, please correct me.
    #33
  14. Rick 91GT

    Rick 91GT SN Certified Technician Site Sponsor

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    Jimmy C and Jimmy Larocca use to turn out some real nice stuff back in the day. The custom manifold is most likely a box style which IMO is not really suited for a mild street car. I do prefer the Accuffab TB however.

    Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk 2
    #34
  15. TOOLOW91

    TOOLOW91 Mustang Master

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    Hey Rick any price break on recal for a pro m ? I have a 75mm for 19s that I want to cal for 24s to replace my c&l


    Sent from my iPhone using my fingers
    #35
  16. Rick 91GT

    Rick 91GT SN Certified Technician Site Sponsor

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    Not really....the recal charge even for me as a dealer is $100

    Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk 2
    #36
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