Should test fitting longtube headers really be this difficult?

[revhead347]

Yeah, there's only one bolt on the steering shaft. You pull that bolt all the way, then compress the steering shaft to slide it off.

Not sure what the deal is on the other side. Is there going to be enough room for a starter in there?

Kurt

 

[Venom351R]

yeah there should be, just does not seem like there is from that angle I had the pic at.

Is it worth taking off the valve cover and tilting the engine like I have been and trying it from the top? It almost seems like it would go in but maybe its just wishful thinking. Also what about unbolting the tranny mount, will that help to give a little more twist of the tranny/engine?

 

[Venom351R]

Things have gone from semi crappy and annoying to serious failure. I decided to work on the drivers side b/c it seemed to be much easier. I unbolted the steering shaft and w/ out even having to raise the engine or the car higher then it was the went right up in. I was starting to feel a lot better about all of this at that time. They seemed to clear everything pretty well so I decided to connect the steering shaft back up just to be sure eveything was all set. I got it to go through the space between the tubes but once the shaft was connected the headers would no longer sit flush with the heads. One of the tubes was hitting the knuckle on the steering shaft and slightly pushing the header enough so that it would not sit flat with the heads. Granted I am trying to do this by myself and its quite difficult but no matter how I maneuvered the header w/ the steering shaft connected it would just not sit flush w/ the head, with it disconnected it was fine. Here are a few pics I tried to get one of where the tube was hitting the knuckle but the oil level tube was kinda in the way. Needless to say I'm kind of at a loss now, WTF am I suppose to do now? I have a set of custom heads and headers but I cant get them to match up with eachother. I'm at the point of just selling the damn heads and getting a normal set of trick flow heads with normal exhaust ports and getting a set of 351 swap headers. I'm just so frustrated that I'm really not sure what my options are.

also to add insult to injury the header bolts I have dont fit the flanges on the headers. These heads have two sets of holes in them for headers to be bolted up. As you can see from the pick there are 4 bolt holes for each port ( 2 on each side of each port) the header flange has holes in it that match up with the holes on the bottom left of the exhaust port and the upper right in a diagonal pattern. The ARP head studs I have screw into the heads in those holes but they do not fit through the holes in the flange on the headers.

 

[revhead347]

Jesus, they have the tubes going around the steering shaft. That setup is always a pain in the ass. The old Mac headers used to be like that, and you had to put the primaries in a vice to flatten them to make the work. Call the guy who made the headers and see if a Flaming River steering shaft is required. It's narrower, and I know some of the headers require them. I'm not quite sure what you are saying about the ARP studs. It looks like a bolt you have in there in the picture. I'm not sure what you having going on there. Are the studs too thick, or are the holes mis aligned? It's just a standard 3/8"-16 bolt hole.

Kurt

 

[Venom351R]

That is an intake stud that I had laying around just to hold the header in place so I could try and bolt the steering shaft back up w/ out them falling out of place. The studs are to thick to fit through the holes in the flanges. The intake stud fits through the flange but the header stud would not.

I sent Accufab an e-mail regarding all the issues with the header fitment and asked about the flaming river steering rack. The cheapest one I could find was $286 shipped. Most were over $300. Still a substantial amount I did not plan on spending at this point.

 

[revhead347]

Welcome to the club. This is so typical of aftermarket parts. If the ARP studs don't fit, I wouldn't use them. I just don't think it's worth the effort of drilling all those bolt holes out. I'd honestly go for a locking set of bolts given how unbelievably tough it is to get those headers in. Do you really want to go back later on and change a gasket if a nut comes lose on those studs?

Kurt

 

[revhead347]

If a different steering shaft is not going to fix the problem, you might want to see if elevating the engine a little gives you proper clearance on the headers. If that's the case, you can put washers between the motor mount and the K-member to get the headers in a position where they won't rub on the steering shaft.

Kurt

 

[Venom351R]

Good point on the header studs. I'll send them back to summit racing. I'll wait to hear back from Accufab before I decide on what to do with the steering shaft issue and if a new one is suggested or if I can just use some washers. There are only two things I have to say about all of this.

1. I just want to get the damn car finished and running again.

2. All this custom Chit had better be worth it HP numbers wise and track time wise or I'll be seriously pissed off at all the time, money, frustration Ive put into this at this point.

 

[revhead347]

Yeah, that's a serious pain in the butt. I recommend the Stage 8 locking bolts. They actually work really well. Summit has the best price on them anyway, and they are easier to deal with on returns if you order something else.

Kurt

 

[ProKiller]

agreed with the stage8's. pain in the butt to install but worth the time and investment. i thought you did pull the tranny mount? that is what we needed to do to get the headers in.

 

[Venom351R]

I'll get the stage 8 bolts and I'll try unbolting the tranny mount to see if I will allow more twist on the engine to clear the passenger side header. Still waiting to hear from accufab

 

[Rick 91GT]

Actually I suggest the Percy split locks, less hassle then the Stage 8's...Ive switched over the past year and love them...



PT# 20005

On the SN cars when I swap to amnual steering you actually just cut the stock shaft and add a FR joint to the bottom. I see they do list a entire new shaft that inludes a new intermediate shaft. Hawaii Racing in CA has really good FR deals...at times they are cheaper then I can buy wholesale.

 

[99FiveOh]

That is an intake stud that I had laying around just to hold the header in place so I could try and bolt the steering shaft back up w/ out them falling out of place. The studs are to thick to fit through the holes in the flanges. The intake stud fits through the flange but the header stud would not.

I sent Accufab an e-mail regarding all the issues with the header fitment and asked about the flaming river steering rack. The cheapest one I could find was $286 shipped. Most were over $300. Still a substantial amount I did not plan on spending at this point.

I think Kurt was talking about the "steering shaft" not the rack.

What a nightmare this seems to be! Because of this thread I have taken a vow to NEVER EVER buy longtubes for any Mustang I will ever own!

 

[revhead347]

I have never seen those split locks before. That's a neat concept. I would be a little concerned with them breaking when they get old and rusty though.

Longtubes are generally very easy. This is just a special case. Shorties just aren't good for performance.

Rick, I don't think your method would work in this situation because it seems to be holding up on the shaft itself not the rag joint. Also, the flaming river steering shaft is. not installed for fitment so much as extra strength due to the extra load manual sterring puts on it.

Kurt

 

[Rick 91GT]

I have never seen those split locks before. That's a neat concept. I would be a little concerned with them breaking when they get old and rusty though.

Longtubes are generally very easy. This is just a special case. Shorties just aren't good for performance.

Rick, I don't think your method would work in this situation because it seems to be holding up on the shaft itself not the rag joint. Also, the flaming river steering shaft is. not installed for fitment so much as extra strength due to the extra load manual sterring puts on it.

Kurt

So far the stainless Percys are holding up well.....well see hehe


I agree on the Flaming River but in most cases they do give your clearance if the rag joint or the large SN shaft is your issue. Most of the time I am just adding the one u joint and swapping to manual steering but I see FR has this product out which looks to be the entire shaft assembly, including the intermediate. Have you ever seen this? I havent used them yet and only saw it last night when I was on their site, they make it for the Power Rack PT#1509VP and Manual PT#1509VM...pricey though over $400

This shaft kit is a direct bolt-in replacement for the factory late model (1994-04) 5.0L steering. Pyramid style, Needle-Bearing Universal Joint. Improves header clearance, with only 1.5" diameter. Vibration dampener kit also available.

 

[revhead347]

I am honestly not really that familiar with their lineup of products. That's pricey.

Kurt

 

[64post]

Did someone forget to include the instructions for those headers? lol. This may be a real stupid question but, did you try removing the accessory bracket with all of its attachments along with the air intake pipe, v/cover etc.. tilting the motor and installing the header from the front? just a thought.

 

[Venom351R]

Rick, those percy bolts are what I took off from the old set up but they wont fit through the flange or screw into the holes that line up with the flange holes. I already tried. They fit the standard holes which the flange covers up.


The flaming river rack is $289 the one that is $400 comes with a vibration damper which I dont think I really need as far as I know. http://www.mperacing.com/suspension.html FR1509P


Post- there is nothing in the way, there is no AC, No Smog, nothing....its just big empty air between the ground and the heads other then the dip stick tube on the driver side

 

[Venom351R]

.

 

[Venom351R]

well I got the correct size bolts today from the big brown truck. There are 14 bolts in the package (which is full) but I need 16 bolts lol. Oh the joys of a custom set up.... These bolt's are the size for a Chrysler (5/16) not the standard ford 3/8 for header bolts so apparently a Chrysler only needs 14 bolts. I'm going to call ARP later today and see what I can do about getting 2 more additional bolts.

I took a few pics b/c I wanted to be sure if there is an adequate amount of threads left to thread into the head to properly secure the headers.