400 HP AT THE WHEELS ALL MOTOR,"YES"!!

Discussion in '2005 - 2009 Specific Tech' started by ranger04, Sep 29, 2007.


  1. Gearbanger 101

    Gearbanger 101 Straight Outta Locash Super Mod

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2002
    Messages:
    14,480
    Likes Received:
    949
    Trophy Points:
    164
    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    Let them cry foul all they want. Blown or not, the bottom line is we're comparing 281 cubic inches to 366 cubic inches.

    They whined like mad how unfair it was that the '03 Cobra was not only waxing their F-Bodies, but their Flagship Corvette as well. They certainly didn't care when the shoe was on the other foot and we were just comparing them in N/A trim with little engine vs. big engine and no equalizer before that. ;)

    As far as I'm concerned, the 3V already outperforms the GM powerplants. It took them 346 cubic inches to make the kind of power Ford is now making with only 281 cubes. That's progress my friend! :nice:
     
    #121
  2. anthony05gt

    anthony05gt Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2006
    Messages:
    1,267
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    37
    Location:
    Maryland
    The Comp cams with the phase limiter plates are the ones I've been leaning towards. The stage 3 version looks pretty good. They require head porting too (on the stage 3) at least to get the full potential out of them. Between the cams, springs, special tools, studs, rotating assy or Aluminator short block....it's all starting to add up. I'm just trying to decide how far to go with this thing.
     
    #122
  3. ranger04

    ranger04 New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2007
    Messages:
    246
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    "O YEAH", speed isn't cheap, unless have a chevy 350 small block ha ha. You can build a chevy small block race engine out of a junkyard. The 302 is getting that way as well, there was an aftermarket parts explodsion for the 5.0 in the 90's. However for us, it will cost 5 grand no matter what we do except for a few basic bolt on's. Any serious power bump is in the 5 grand range. That one advantage with going all motor, you can add a piece here and there as the money comes available. I'm not sure how far I want to go either. I'm just taking my time and watching to see what else comes out for the 3 valve. I know I want to do a stroker, 5.0 just sounds better than 4.6 if nothing else ha ha. I saw a 5.0 stroker block for 3,200$, thats not bad for a mod motor I supose, and it had forged internials if you did want to go FI.
     
    #123
  4. PDXStangDude

    PDXStangDude Member

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2006
    Messages:
    166
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    16
    Location:
    Tigard, Oregon
    :nice::hail2:
     
    #124
  5. ranger04

    ranger04 New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2007
    Messages:
    246
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    That is so true, ford has done an awesome job with the 4.6 3 valve mod motor. It's quite an acheivement to get 300 hp and 320 foot pounds from only a 281 CID engine thats being mass produced in a street car that passes emissions. Now we have some engine builders are close to getting 400 hp from the 281 CID engine, all motor. One is way over 400 hp all motor with a bump in displacement to only 298. They got 401 hp at the rear wheels and still passed emissions. Ford has done alot with very little so to speak. I'm proud of our mod motors and whats been accomplished. Now ford needs to bump displacement a tad to give us 2 retro engine sizes to match our retro stangs, the 5.0 and 5.8 (302 and 351). That would be icing on the cake. I've read articles that sugested were going to get just that, a 5.0 for the GT and the 5.8 for special edition stangs. The 5.0 is a sure bet, I just hope the 5.8 pans out as well.
     
    #125
  6. StonePony

    StonePony New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2006
    Messages:
    218
    Showcase:
    15
    Albums:
    1
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I dont blelieve they will put out either 5.0 or 5.8 engines.
     
    #126
  7. Gearbanger 101

    Gearbanger 101 Straight Outta Locash Super Mod

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2002
    Messages:
    14,480
    Likes Received:
    949
    Trophy Points:
    164
    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    At least not in the traditional pushrod OHV configuration we remember them in? :notnice:
     
    #127
  8. ranger04

    ranger04 New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2007
    Messages:
    246
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Of course not, the new 302 and 351 would be mod motors. Ford has alot of time and money in the mod motor, there not going to turn back now I was reading motor trend in the doctors office yesterday. MT even said there will be a new 5.0 for the stang a long with the ecoboost V-6 and a varrant of the 6.2 boss engine. They gave no release dates, but it sounded like the 2010 stangs would start out slow with the new engines with more added on during the production run. We will get the 5.0 I believe, and the ecoboost and 351 will come later, thats the way I took it anyhow. You can check out the article in the latest edition of Motor Trend, It has a siver with blue stripes shelby GT 500 KR on the cover.
     
    #128
  9. Gearbanger 101

    Gearbanger 101 Straight Outta Locash Super Mod

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2002
    Messages:
    14,480
    Likes Received:
    949
    Trophy Points:
    164
    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    Alas, it may not be the reality we all hoped it would be.....:(

    2010 Boss Ford Mustang Retired before Hired - Ford Mustang | StangNet.com
     
    #129
  10. StonePony

    StonePony New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2006
    Messages:
    218
    Showcase:
    15
    Albums:
    1
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    My new Motor Trend has a big yellow 2010 Camaro on the cover.
    I have also heard the Boss motor will never see a production Mustang.
     
    #130
  11. ranger04

    ranger04 New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2007
    Messages:
    246
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I don't know for sure if it was the latest edition, I didn't look at the date on the mag. The mag just looked in good shape to be too old and it had a silver shelby gt 500 kr on the cover. I heard the boss 6.2 won't make it into the mustang either, I heard a 5.8 version of it will. There's so much hype going around right now, we will just have to wait and see. It really matters not, I'm stuck with my 07. I had to pull teeth just to get the wife to agree to that. So I'm going to quit while I'm a head and just worry about what I can do to the car I have now.
     
    #131
  12. KMRACER

    KMRACER New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2008
    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    i think its HILARIOUS how you guys are FIRST off so damn afraid to turn wrenches on your cars. and SECOND seem to think that N/A power is MORE EXPENSIVE than FORCED INDUCTION is plain wrong. SURE, to bolt on a supercharger and make 410 to the wheels on an ENTIRELY stock engine, but once you start throwing more boost/power at it you'll need fuel upgrades soon. honestly if you guys are just gonna be close minded and say NO it'll never happen and S/C is the only way to go then parts are NEVER going to be cheap and doing h/c on these cars never will be either. but if you guys go get your tiny little frail hands dirty and make ***** happen you guys might actually see alot of the prices get alot cheaper.


    WHERE ARE ALL THE INSTALL GUIDES??!?!? WHY DOES IT SEEM LIKE MUSTANG GUYS JUST PAY PEOPLE TO WORK ON THEIR CARS?!?! WHAT HAPPENED TO US? GO GET DIRTY! FIGURE ***** OUT! BE INNOVATIVE! PUSH THE BOUNDRIES.

    and i KNOW that 400whp is possible. people just need to get out there and do it. the same thing happened with ls1's and look at them now.... ADVANCE! BECOME BETTER! PRICES WILL FOLLOW.
     
    #132
  13. DiMora

    DiMora New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2008
    Messages:
    60
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    You have to work smarter with what you have. If you don't like what you have, get something different.

    Forced Induction is the cat's jammies on a 'Stang motor. Sorry. That is just how it goes.

    I bought a 445 Roushcharger on Ebay and bolted it on myself. Added a 2.57 puley and Steeda CAI. Downtime? A day and a half, then off to the tuner / dyno for 3 hours of tuning.

    And a Roushcharger is a dog as far as forced induction goes - and I can barely get the power to the ground. It is a sick ride.

    My tuner has a brand new Challenger (about 250 miles on it) and it has a Kenne Bell prototype blower being strapped onto it as I type this.

    There is always going to be someone faster with more cubes, more PSI, more HP, more torque, and a faster 1/4 mile.

    Me? I like the look of the 'Stang, so it was a good choice, and my Ebay blower was a smokin' hot deal, especially since I am not afraid to get dirty.

    If I want to play the the "my car is faster than your car" game, I can pull my motor, add forged internals, a GT500 pump setup and a Roush TVS blower or a Kenne Bell twin-screw and put down 600 horsepower TO THE REAR WHEELS. Now that is working smarter, not harder. It would take me a few days.

    Shoot, with my Roushcharger already on there, I could add the TVS in half a day and make a de-tuned 460 to the rear wheels, with a ton of bottom end torque - and sell my Roushcharger for $3000-3500.

    You can whine all day about FI vs all engine, and I'll make my supercharger whine and show you my taillights. :rock:
     
    #133
  14. KMRACER

    KMRACER New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2008
    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    yea... but i can take a stock ls1, spend 300 bucks on a set of pace setter headers 700 on a cam do whatever exhaust i wanted and a 100 air lid and make 430hp to the wheels. i just built and tuned an ls1 making 445hp to the WHEELS with UN TOUCHED stock heads. thats with a fast 92mm intake and an ms3 cam. no elect water pump no tricks.

    honestly, 5 years ago guys woulda been lucky to get that with heads. but the more and more research thats done the better things are going to get. if you guys are afraid to push the boundries of the n/a setups, or everyone just says **** n/a go F/I, nothing will ever change. cam companies will see no point in developing better cams, the same with cyl head companies. if no one spends money in heads then why make them better? they see no market. thats why the first set of heads for an ls1 came out years ago and you guys are just getting your first set from trick flow. how many brands make aftermarket (not stock ported) heads for ls motors? 5 big brands off the top of my head. but theres more then that im sure.


    point being this. why NOT go n/a? why NOT try and take an n/a 4.6 as far as it can go? the 3v heads have HUGE potential. you guys just need to get your ducks in a row and start throwing some combos together. 400whp n/a WILL come. then 420. who knows where you'll be in 5 years... 530whp stock short block ls1's are just around the corner FYI. 520 has been done.

    good day chaps!
     
    #134
  15. o0Dan0o

    o0Dan0o Founding Member

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2001
    Messages:
    485
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Apples to oranges. Yes, NA is fun, I very well may stay NA (I think 400 rwhp is possible on the stock block). But don't compare the ls1 to the mod motor. 1.1L advantage makes all the difference. The only way to get more power, beyond a point, is with more displacement, more compression, or more boost.
    Dan
     
    #135
  16. 08blueskunk

    08blueskunk New Member

    Joined:
    May 8, 2008
    Messages:
    219
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    Maine
    GN WILL GO BANKRUPT AND THERE WILL ONLY BE 1!!
     
    #136
  17. NotQuik

    NotQuik Founding Member

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2000
    Messages:
    5,185
    Showcase:
    7
    Albums:
    2
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    Central Florida
    plain the simple the 3v won't make the power of the ls1, time for a lsx swap ;)
     
    #137
  18. Gearbanger 101

    Gearbanger 101 Straight Outta Locash Super Mod

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2002
    Messages:
    14,480
    Likes Received:
    949
    Trophy Points:
    164
    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    Oh god...not the whole...the LS1 can do this, the LS1 can do that arguement again? :rolleyes:

    That's funny...the one thing the LS1 couldn't do was stay in production. :rlaugh:
     
    #138
  19. UrbanRedneck

    UrbanRedneck New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2008
    Messages:
    174
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    uh.. actually there's quite a few production cars and trucks with LS engines...
     
    #139
  20. Gearbanger 101

    Gearbanger 101 Straight Outta Locash Super Mod

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2002
    Messages:
    14,480
    Likes Received:
    949
    Trophy Points:
    164
    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    I'll say it again....LS1 ;)


    ....and you really need to learn to recognize sarcastic remark when it’s presented in front of you. :D

    For those who choose to continue this same old tired argument.....the bottom line, is who gives a crap what you can do with an LS1? :shrug: This is a Mustang site. If the engine impresses you that much, you need to join LS1.com or something. The N/A argument most of you guys use is moot and quite utterly a ridiculous comparison! It’s easy to brag about the ability to produce N/A power when you're comparing 346ci to 281ci. The engine superiority point is also crap. Yes, the OHC could use a tougher set of rods and pistons from the factory for big power figures….but that’s nothing more than a material issue. The design itself is sound and the engine performs flawlessly within its given power ranges for 200....300....even 400K. Truth be told, the Ford OHC design itself is the far more efficient set up of the two, but people are so blinded by the raw power output figures that it seems to go unrecognized. As its been stated hundreds and hundreds of times already, it’s the displacement that makes all the difference in this equation, not because the LS1/2 is a better design. Don't wanna take my word for it...that's fine....dumb down the LS1 displacement to 281ci and see how “superior” the power production is by comparison to the Ford Mill then. :shrug:

    Till then, the LSX nut huggers are ice skating uphill. :)

    Now bring on the flaming!!!
     
    #140

Share This Page