05 Mustang GT Engine

[Lawman85]

well i know that they had to modify the bay to fit the 5.4 in the 00 cobra r

blah blah blah.... use a 3lb sledge, hammer out the fender wells, and drop the V10 in it.... lol



Isn't that the way they squeezed the 428 and 429's in the 69's?

 

[351CJ]

Think it over for a second -- the 4.6L is a 90* V8, so for every X distance you increase the height of the deck, you are going to get roughly X/2 increase in both width and overall height of the engine (assuming all else being equal).

Dave

A little trigonometry refresher.

The cylinder banks are at a 45 degree angle to the vertical centerline of the engine. So the relationship of height & width to deck height is .707 which is the sine or cosine of 45 degrees. (or you can use the formula hypotenuse = square root of x^2 + y^2).

That is if you raise the deck height by 1", the overall height of the engine increases by .707" and the width of each cylinder bank increases by .707". However there are 2 cylinder banks so the overall width of the engine will increase by 1.414".

Specifically regarding the 5.4 vs 4.6 engines, the deck height on the 5.4 is 29mm higher = 1.1417" higher. So the 5.4L (given the same heads) will be 1.615" wider than a 4.6. The 5.4 will be .807" higher than a 4.6 before you add on the intake manifold.

 

[351CJ]

Just another thought, a 5.4L SOHC 3 valve engine is smaller than a 4.6L DOHC 4 valve engine. So if the 4.6L DOHC will fit, as it does in the 04 Mustang, putting a 5.4L SOHC 3 valve engine in a 05 Mustang will be a piece of cake. Squeezing in a 5.4L DOHC could be a problem, but the new 3V heads flow almost as well as the DOHC heads so who cares of a 5.4 DOHC won't fit.

I still think that we will see the top of the line 06 or 07 Mustang get some form of the 5.4L S/C engine from the Ford GT. Or maybe it will be a 3 valve version.

 

[bigred0383]

Math...head hurting. As far as the 5.4 3valve being smaller than the 4.6 4valve: does the extra valve really make than much of a difference? I am not questioning your judgement, I just am astounded that it plays that big of a role size wise. Guess that shows you how much I know about engines.

 

[Rootus]

A little trigonometry refresher.

I skipped trig, sorry . And my degree is in computer science, not math. Sue me.

Dave

 

[Vlad]

Think it over for a second -- the 4.6L is a 90* V8, so for every X distance you increase the height of the deck, you are going to get roughly X/2 increase in both width and overall height of the engine (assuming all else being equal).

Dave

yep, didnt think before I rsponded. just file that under 'duh'

 

[351CJ]

I skipped trig, sorry . And my degree is in computer science, not math. Sue me.

Dave

Am I that old and out of touch? I got taught trig. in high school. What the hell do they teach you kids in HS these days anyway?

 

[351CJ]

Math...head hurting. As far as the 5.4 3valve being smaller than the 4.6 4valve: does the extra valve really make than much of a difference? I am not questioning your judgement, I just am astounded that it plays that big of a role size wise. Guess that shows you how much I know about engines.

It's not the extra valve that makes the big difference, it's the extra cam.

 

[Rootus]

Am I that old and out of touch? I got taught trig. in high school. What the hell do they teach you kids in HS these days anyway?

Hahaha... nah, I skipped trig and went directly to Calculus in high school. And I started with Calculus (six terms of it) in college, got straight-A's even .

I was just kidding anyway, I know plenty of trig, that's why I was allowed to skip it. I just had a brain fart when I wrote my message to that guy and I was only trying to point out that an increase in deck height meant more than just getting taller in the engine bay.

And I only *wish* I was a kid...

Dave

 

[351CJ]

Hahaha... nah, I skipped trig and went directly to Calculus in high school. Dave

OK Dave, I feel a lot better now that I know my tax dollars aren't being completely wasted.

 

[Omegalock]

Start worrying again. I'm just 9 years out of high school and I don't remember a lick of the Trig or Cal I had in school.

 

[USAF-Sergeant]

More detail please

It's not the extra valve that makes the big difference, it's the extra cam.

Would you mind going into more detail on just how that helps? You said the extra cam helps, but the 4.6 is still a SOHC. I would understand you responce better if it was a DOHC. Thanks for the help.

 

[351CJ]

Would you mind going into more detail on just how that helps? You said the extra cam helps, but the 4.6 is still a SOHC. I would understand you responce better if it was a DOHC. Thanks for the help.

Go back and re-read the thread.

I made the comment that the 5.4L SOHC 3 valve is physically smaller than the 4.6L DOHC 4 valve.

Someone made the comment "the extra valve makes a big difference, I don't understand"

So what I was saying is that the DOHC 4 valve heads are physically HUGE which make the 4.6 DOHC a HUGE engine.

Bottom line is that I'm guessing that a 5.4 DOHC engine will not fit into the 05 Stang, but a 5.4 SOHC engine (as well as a 4.6L DOHC) will fit into the 05 Stang.

You also have to figure in that fitting is one thing, but being able to install the engine from the bottom of the car as it is done on the assembly line is something else.

I'm still guessing that we will see a 5.4L DOHC engine in the Cobra-R, but like the last R it will be a limited production vehicle possibly finished off the line. All other 05 and later variants will be built on the same assembly line and will have to fit the restrictions of that line - the engine must be able to be installed from below with adequate clearance.

 

[demillso]

Math...head hurting. As far as the 5.4 3valve being smaller than the 4.6 4valve: does the extra valve really make than much of a difference? I am not questioning your judgement, I just am astounded that it plays that big of a role size wise. Guess that shows you how much I know about engines.

Its not the extra valve that makes the difference, its the extra cam that makes the heads so much wider. Also, while we're dreaming of engines, does anyone have any measurements on the DOHC V10 that the Cobra and 427 concepts used?